Comments on: To the synod office http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/ The Blog of the Provost of St Mary's Cathedral, Glasgow Mon, 06 Feb 2012 21:21:47 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Andrew http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8280 Andrew Sat, 21 Mar 2009 23:55:31 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8280 I think that it is nearer to the mark to describe 'The Scottish Field' (or was when we lived in Bromley and it was the most exciting post of the month) as 'Unionist' The Editor in the 1950's lived about 2 miles away in South London so The Scottish Field kept us in touch with Jimmy Shand, John Buchan, The Edinburgh Tattoo and The Fortingall Yew Tree. And those sherry party photographs to commemorate Law Firm anniversaries. We couldn't recognise anyone but they looked nicer than the people who came to our own parties. So we grew in ignorance monthly as we happily anticipated another 3 weeks in Pitlochry. However in 2009, Old SF's appearing in Room 1 must herald the employment of a dentist in Forbes House, or a gentle reminder of 'The Homecoming'. I believe they provide the 'Peoples Friend' at 121 George Street, but I could be wrong. I think that it is nearer to the mark to describe ‘The Scottish Field’ (or was when we lived in Bromley and it was the most exciting post of the month) as ‘Unionist’
The Editor in the 1950′s lived about 2 miles away in South London so The Scottish Field kept us in touch with Jimmy Shand, John Buchan, The Edinburgh Tattoo and The Fortingall Yew Tree. And those sherry party photographs to commemorate Law Firm anniversaries. We couldn’t recognise anyone but they looked nicer than the people who came to our own parties. So we grew in ignorance monthly as we happily anticipated another 3 weeks in Pitlochry.
However in 2009, Old SF’s appearing in Room 1 must herald the employment of a dentist in Forbes House, or a gentle reminder of ‘The Homecoming’. I believe they provide the ‘Peoples Friend’ at 121 George Street, but I could be wrong.

]]> By: David Bayne http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8264 David Bayne Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:12:49 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8264 "Annabelle, our Bishop" has a certain something, don't you think? The age restrictions on Ordination that we are in process of removing did have a point. They were introduced across most post-Reformation denominations (I'm not sure about the RCC) to prevent beardless youths being presented to (with!) prosperous and influential livings by well-connected parents. My favourite Scottish example is Alexander Stewart, the illegitimate son of James IV who was made Archbishop of St. Andrews in 1504 at the age of 14 - or, possibly, 11. The archdiocese didn't have to cope with a half-century episcopate, though: he died fighting beside his father at Flodden. Being of a slightly earlier vintage than The Provost, it's the moving of the upper limit that has me exercised. Combined with the hole in the pension fund, it hints at a return to "ad vitam aut culpam" By the time people are worried about me having done 50 years in CD, I'll be 97........... “Annabelle, our Bishop” has a certain something, don’t you think?

The age restrictions on Ordination that we are in process of removing did have a point. They were introduced across most post-Reformation denominations (I’m not sure about the RCC) to prevent beardless youths being presented to (with!) prosperous and influential livings by well-connected parents. My favourite Scottish example is Alexander Stewart, the illegitimate son of James IV who was made Archbishop of St. Andrews in 1504 at the age of 14 – or, possibly, 11. The archdiocese didn’t have to cope with a half-century episcopate, though: he died fighting beside his father at Flodden.

Being of a slightly earlier vintage than The Provost, it’s the moving of the upper limit that has me exercised. Combined with the hole in the pension fund, it hints at a return to “ad vitam aut culpam” By the time people are worried about me having done 50 years in CD, I’ll be 97………..

]]> By: Robin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8262 Robin Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:49:20 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8262 I meant to write, "being stuck with her/him for half a century if...." I meant to write,

“being stuck with her/him for half a century if….”

]]> By: Robin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8261 Robin Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:48:13 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8261 > But no – I’m 42.

So you *are* the answer to the riddle of the Universe!

I’d have imagined there would have been an exemption for such things. An 18yo Bishop would be a bit ridiculous, to say nothing of the risk of being stuck with her/him if she/he proved a bad choice. However, I don’t expect it will make any practical difference. Even under the existing Canon, did we ever have a Bishop as young as 30? The youngest I can think of was my own mentor, Bishop George Sessford, who was 42 when he was consecrated . . .

]]> By: kelvin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8260 kelvin Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:14:26 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8260 I'm ridiculously flattered on all counts. But no - I'm 42. Lower age limits are being removed from ordination canons because of the risk of it being seen as age discrimination. (Well, actually, because it was clear age discrimination). I’m ridiculously flattered on all counts. But no – I’m 42.

Lower age limits are being removed from ordination canons because of the risk of it being seen as age discrimination.

(Well, actually, because it was clear age discrimination).

]]> By: Robin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8259 Robin Sun, 15 Mar 2009 13:51:34 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8259 > Robin - we are in the process of removing the 30 year lower age limit for bishops this year. Is this to remedy the understandable confusion potentially caused among electors by your being eminently 'episcopabile' while you still look as if you're well under 30? > Robin – we are in the process of removing the 30 year lower age limit for bishops this year.

Is this to remedy the understandable confusion potentially caused among electors by your being eminently ‘episcopabile’ while you still look as if you’re well under 30?

]]> By: kelvin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8250 kelvin Sat, 14 Mar 2009 20:48:41 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8250 Robin - we are in the process of removing the 30 year lower age limit for bishops this year. If Ms Goldie turns out to be younger than we think, she is still in with a shout. David - thanks for your post. It is similar to what's been said to me in synod. To be honest, as someone whose formative years were mainly in a part of the country where the dominant industry was coal, the idea that the farming/rural economy has been particularly ill treated by either European or national government thinking has always seemed very puzzling. There are many things which bring town and country together. Clergy complain of the same degrees of isolation in town and country, for example. People also often complain about the ability of young people in the country to find affordable housing locally. However, to someone who has lived succesively in Perth, Bridge of Allan and the West End of Glasgow, that complaint again seems to unite rather than divide us. As for field sports, I feel less strongly about the sports themselves than I did when I was younger. However, I feel more strongly than ever that all of us, whatever sector of society we live in can only muddle along by a common respect for the law and it has sometimes been difficult for someone like me to perceive such a respect in those advocating certain field sports. I don't think field sports are a human rights issue. And I don't think that civil disobedience (ie lawbreaking) is an appropriate or proportionate response to the banning of hunting with hounds. Robin – we are in the process of removing the 30 year lower age limit for bishops this year. If Ms Goldie turns out to be younger than we think, she is still in with a shout.

David – thanks for your post. It is similar to what’s been said to me in synod. To be honest, as someone whose formative years were mainly in a part of the country where the dominant industry was coal, the idea that the farming/rural economy has been particularly ill treated by either European or national government thinking has always seemed very puzzling.

There are many things which bring town and country together. Clergy complain of the same degrees of isolation in town and country, for example. People also often complain about the ability of young people in the country to find affordable housing locally. However, to someone who has lived succesively in Perth, Bridge of Allan and the West End of Glasgow, that complaint again seems to unite rather than divide us.

As for field sports, I feel less strongly about the sports themselves than I did when I was younger. However, I feel more strongly than ever that all of us, whatever sector of society we live in can only muddle along by a common respect for the law and it has sometimes been difficult for someone like me to perceive such a respect in those advocating certain field sports.

I don’t think field sports are a human rights issue. And I don’t think that civil disobedience (ie lawbreaking) is an appropriate or proportionate response to the banning of hunting with hounds.

]]> By: Robin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8249 Robin Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:39:47 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8249 > Would it be out of the question, Robin, for Ms Goldie to become the new Bishop of Glasgow and Galloway? As far as I know, it would be OK, since she's baptised and over 30! And Glasgow & Galloway has had a Bishop Goldie before, so there's precedent! > Would it be out of the question, Robin, for Ms Goldie to become the new Bishop of Glasgow and Galloway?

As far as I know, it would be OK, since she’s baptised and over 30! And Glasgow & Galloway has had a Bishop Goldie before, so there’s precedent!

]]> By: David http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8248 David Sat, 14 Mar 2009 13:47:44 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8248 As a born n' bred countryman, it's at least refreshing to see an admission that "...townies know nothing about the country." For too long the rural economy has been dealt blow after blow by politicans and civil servants who have no understanding of the countryside and the people who live and work there. Country folk, particularly farmers in recent years, face challenges every bit as painful as those who inhabit inner cities. Suicide rates are proportionately higher than in urban areas and the pastoral issues for rural clergy (often lacking the support of clergy teams) equally as challenging. It's understandable that town/city dwellers perhaps find field sports and other aspects of country life distateful, not having been reared to them and not fully understanding what is actually going on - fed, as they often are on an unbalanced diet supplied by the media and politicians with a class chip on their shoulder. However, I would ask that urban folks try to show a degree of tolerance and cease from their continual bashing of country people, their lifestyles and their economy. The countryside is not a playground for city dwellers at weekends and holidays - for many of us it is home and a workplace. As a born n’ bred countryman, it’s at least refreshing to see an admission that “…townies know nothing about the country.” For too long the rural economy has been dealt blow after blow by politicans and civil servants who have no understanding of the countryside and the people who live and work there. Country folk, particularly farmers in recent years, face challenges every bit as painful as those who inhabit inner cities. Suicide rates are proportionately higher than in urban areas and the pastoral issues for rural clergy (often lacking the support of clergy teams) equally as challenging.
It’s understandable that town/city dwellers perhaps find field sports and other aspects of country life distateful, not having been reared to them and not fully understanding what is actually going on – fed, as they often are on an unbalanced diet supplied by the media and politicians with a class chip on their shoulder. However, I would ask that urban folks try to show a degree of tolerance and cease from their continual bashing of country people, their lifestyles and their economy. The countryside is not a playground for city dwellers at weekends and holidays – for many of us it is home and a workplace.

]]> By: kelvin http://www.thurible.net/20090313/to-the-synod-office/#comment-8246 kelvin Fri, 13 Mar 2009 22:45:35 +0000 http://www.thurible.net/?p=6018#comment-8246 My prejudices were formed by doing a curacy in Perthshire. I'd love them to be completly inaccurate. However, I'm aware that I was not the only person in the room yesterday who perceived the mag as a symbol of a right-wing rural affairs agenda. Us townies know nothing about the country. At least, it would seem that way by the way I've heard people speak at diocesan and general synods. My prejudices were formed by doing a curacy in Perthshire. I’d love them to be completly inaccurate.

However, I’m aware that I was not the only person in the room yesterday who perceived the mag as a symbol of a right-wing rural affairs agenda.

Us townies know nothing about the country. At least, it would seem that way by the way I’ve heard people speak at diocesan and general synods.

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